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Nice to meet you. Your experiment seems more about subjective preferences rather then proving some scientific preference of difference between the tuning systems.

If you take into account that preference is really subjective and not objective; there is no more science- much how devious corporation manipulate statistics. Our preferences are based on individual experience, history, culture, social factors ect.

Ask a test subject who has grown up listening to eastern music tuning systems…. I think your experiment proves nothing except that north american people prefer what they know!!!

All the academies of science have corrupted truth to promote the agenda that has caused all the suffering of man in the last years. Order out of Chaos is their MOA. The music is chaotic also if you have a trained ear and try and tune a guitar referenced to A If you ever listened to a person sing out of tune and it sounded good to you then anything would. If you have published any music in a public forum i would be eager to hear what your ability to tell the difference is.

I was the best at what music I produced compared to every other musician on the same instrument in the state of Florida. That was not by chance but because I can hear and produce, even with the corrupted scale a sound that is in tune and recognizably superior to others , even the untrained.

Thanks for your comment. Send me a link with proof of your musical accomplishments please. Did you study how pitch shift actually works? Did you read the code of typical pitch shift DSP? We came to that conclusion already 3 years ago. The correct method is the use the same idea in the digital domain, as slowing down a record player in the analog domain, so a Hz tone becomes Hz, and the tempo also goes down by 1.

In the digital domain this can be done using the speed or playback rate method, which both slows down the tempo as well as the pitch accordingly. We did a test with 60 candidates and 58 preferred the Hz version. This was with the foobar rate method as part of the soundtouch plugin set to Everybody who visits our shop is convinced by the effect of Hz. Typically one in ten hesitates. What is the correct method? I mailed my friend Roel Hollander who updated his site about Hz live playback, with the correct settings for foobar.

Here it is:. But when you slow down open goldberg variations with 1. So the Hz effect has nothing to do with slowing down a record, but map the A to a frequency that is natural to our ears.

If you want to setup test groups, I can help. Frederic Vanden Poel you just made my week and blew my mind at the same time!! But I have been saying the same thing as you.

Even using vinyl records as the example like you did. I am so happy to read your post and many of the recent posts by people who really know what is happening and have the inquisitive and intelligent nature to see through the BS and find actual honest answers!

Love your post so much. Ok, guys, some of you do not understand tuning and the equal tempered system. All is going to do is to slow down the music so that note, and only that note is part of the hz tuning! The other 11 tones are going to have the same ratios as !!!! To obtain , or other system, you have to tune the instruments to , that will change the ratios across the whole spectrum.!!! There us nothing sacred or magical about a second!

Now, ratios, proportions, golden ratio, Fibonacci, etc, etc ARE universal constants of beauty and order, in maths, arts, geometry, architecture, phisics, and music.

How do you see that as happening? All tones would get a shift. The ratio between notes will be the same. An octave will still be an octave. Other notes will be on a different Hz as well.

Is it Hz that is natural to our ears? Are you saying our ears amplify Hz more than other Hz? Has a resonance at that Hz?

In fact, tuning signficantly impacts vocalists who will find high C is lowered, which saves voice strain. Historically, Handel preferred and Mozart , the only reason that A tuning went up was because of larger venues. In fact it rose to nearly Hz but the French enacted a law lowering it because singers started protesting…nothing evil about but there are differences….

Though I cannot completely disprove the mumbo-jumbo effects of Hz no one can , I will have to agree with Reasonable Person. If we used a different starting point for defining frequencies, what sounds like Hz might be defined as 33 Dt instead, yet still have the same exact wavelength.

The main arguments I managed to grasp were:. The method he used to alter the pitch could have been better chosen. His application of the scientific method was flawed, specifically in his lack of a control group and misuse of statistics.

The exceedingly common use of Hz in the 20th century and beyond automatically biases the results. You claim that the artifacts produced from his pitch-shifting method degrades recorded music more than another example the that slows it down. That would be interesting, but it would be different experiment. It would seem to me the method Trevor used had sound reasoning, as it was attempting to test the validity of the majority of the pitch comparisons found on Youtube.

Using one method over another is not less scientific, though I would agree that using several methods is more scientific. To top it all, the researcher did in fact acknowledge the possibility of a bias against the higher frequencies due to artifacts.

This seems scientifically ethical. As for a misapplication of the scientific method, nah-ah. The statistics used are sound, well-explained, and are by no means misleading. Though I will agree there may be a bias to Hz because of lifetime exposure to that tuning, this fact does not invalidate the experiment.

This is again a challenge based on the experiments control method. Though blind experiments and random-sampling are not the most ideal control methods, they are necessary fallbacks when experimenting with human beings. Perhaps we should find a humans at normal age, who have been raised in a neutral environment, fed completely standard diets, and have never heard any music at all, to participate as the control group.

This should sound retarded because it is. Sometimes one has to accept an imperfect method to control an experiment. Lastly, Mr. Find a new hobby. Well Mr. No pretending in that telling name. Like some of the other people I know that are puffed up in their own mind because they paid for a college professor to tell them how smart they were for wasting money on nonsense, you do your screen name service. If the elements and the world we inhabit have no natural harmonics associated with them then your argument would have an ounce of merit.

Since everything does resonate at frequencies related to their structure you have not even your delusional paid for intelligence to stand on. Since you took a bit of time to ramble against me I will give you just a bit of mine. My back was healed of a herniated disc during the same days I was researching this musical scale. I am a follower and servant of Jesus Christ the only begotten son of the only true and living God. Satan is come to kill and to steal and to destroy.

Since he has no power over me, neither do you have any to shake my faith or my renewed back, which carried me miles on a motorcycle trip last week when a 20 mile trip was painful before last month.

Even before my healing this 53 year old faith filled follower of Christ could have made short work of you in a face to face debate or a face to face,wall to wall counseling session. Here is my Address if you want to stop by and insult me face to face, man to man. Whittier NC. Thanks for your unintelligent imaginations you took time to spew at me.

Looking forward to meeting you. Come on by. I fear only God, never a troll like you. Conventional history is a joke.

Keep in mind, there have been continuous lineages of knowledge that have kept their secrets guarded for thousands of years. How much did you pay for your wrong opinion?

Just as you said, they supposedly measured nature and that is where they got the metric system. Metrology is what it is called. More can be learned from doing than reading bookworm. Demonstration of science through repeatable experiments is where the rubber meats the road. Americans are dumb as shit and you are not even up to that standard. Watch this short video and deny the facts for your delusions. Did you learn that in the field or in college? Trevor Cox. It would seem to be possible to make one anecdotal observation about this thread.

As above, so below, etc, etc. Cox, I had to look up verisimilitude, because my vocabulary is not as some more well read persons would be, and I believe I can take that as a complement.

If people could experience the trials I went through in the pursuit of this scale, they would be convinced without question.

Have a nice Sabbath rest. Bookworm: That there are 43, seconds in 12 hours seems interesting. How does that relate back to Hz? OR if you say that is the answer, what does that mean? Or why would that be significant? But the overtones from such a low cycle as the earth rotating become too close together to be meaningful in any way once it gets into human audible range.

But how does that equate to Hz? Or why does it make sense to do so? Discarding or approving it because of being a nazi discovery is a fallacy of first order, you are right the colorature of the two clips has been changed greately, specially in the hi range, you would have to tune the instrument s to x reference for one clip and to y reference in the other, and then you get closer but still there are to many variables, also how much unconciusly are people used to listening to music in hz plays a role.

You would have to take two groups of individuals put them on a blind, Expose each to x or y for a considerable amount of time every day for a long time, taking physical and psychological tests periodically. But I do believe your experiment does expose the precarian state in wich pitch shifting technology is at the moment.

If you play the guitar and try and tune it to the scale I researched you would hear the difference. Shit is not profanity. It is excrement, and comparable to the level of education that people like you seem to exhibit. Either be willing to test it and prove or disprove it or drop it. I try and test even what every one believes is true but have never tested them selves.

For instance, the speed of light is not a constant. Why would they say it is then. Time is the constant, and that is why the frequencies we worship the creator with matter. You just want confrontation. Proclaiming to be wise, you have become a fool. Have a nice day, in your imaginary superiority. The tuner I downloaded does not work well with the microphone I use so I am a couple hz of form the ideal.

In my scale the The half step between G and A is where the countdown at the 64th decimal place happens 7 times when dividing and multiplying back and forth, before it reaches equilibrium.

Yes , with the Square root of , being approx hz. The notes in the hz range fall at appox. Thanks for taking the time to listen. Sorry for my fumbling around with the words. Almost everyone is misinterpreting the application of the theory. Secondly, mp3 and digital compression take out much of the interesting harmonic information that is recreated anyway.

An mp3 is a heavily-compressed sample. I think then you would be able to listen to the differences and decide which you prefer. Agreed JP. I had to scroll through a lot of rubbish to finally get to a real answer. Pingback: guru post. Just commented on the earlier post so wanted to share my preference of these two as well.

I preferred the hz, the hz lacked fullness and some of the guitar picks were too high-pitched which hurt my ears. I have been working with music and sound for over 30 years. To do a real comparison the recordings MUST be equal and only the instruments tuned to the new frequency. But while a pure, harmonic A scale at Hz might be sweet as, the well tempered scale is a inherently imperfect to allow for other root notes on the piano keyboard.

So certain tones will always be a little bit off unless the same rigor is applied to the interrelationship of the whole scale. At the end of the day there are a large number of ingredients in making good music and I encourage anyone to experiment and finding new ways of putting mathematics, human emotion and intent into the aether! Two things, One pitch shifting is not the same as rearranging the entire scale to The only examples of music that people listen to are in hz, so asking people their preference is pointless since they will choose always.

You cant break a habit that easily. Emmanuel, I had read your article in french first, thanks for publishing an English translation. Exactly what I think all people here are looking for. I will paraphrase you here, beware of any proposal of adopting rigid, absolute systems of thought that states something is bad and some other thing is good,. Hi Carlos, Thank you for your testimony. Is the perfect sound tuning for every song going to be different then? Since a song in the key of A sounds to most people better tuned as HZ than , and since each labeled-by-ISO key is based on the mathematical info.

Also, Hz is just a measure of distance of wavelengths, what if there were more accurate units of measurement. What about the semitone scales of the east? They must be closer inline with the vibrations of the universe. I digress. Since Frequency is based on our man-made Second an arbitrary length of time the chances that the perfect resonant pivot will be an integer are incredibly slim.

Science in art and vice versa have always walked together hand in hand so it makes me smile all this debate. I never understood this idea of tuning. I can lay down a track at whatever pitch I choose- tune to any frequency and all that is required if I want to play with others or synchronise with them, is for them to be able to do that on their chosen instrument in a way that works with me and is harmonious etc etc.

We can choose whatever we want. We all know the effect of frequencies and vibrations is not in dispute, we know standing next to a cement drill without protection will damage our ears eventually, we know we can break a pane of glass with the right frequency, we can boil water with sound- we can soothe a child or heal a worried mind — or reach states of elevated consciousness.

The interdependence of all things means fundamentals like frequency are a key component in our well being- fact.

Thing I want to know is who and why was it decided that would be standard? The way we perceive sounds is infinite and has no standardisation- music has combinations and frequencies that work for healing and ones that will promote discordance in which also are infinite layers and dimensions that in turn will affect each person different and yet the same- vice versa.

Thoughts are frequencies, emotions are and so are sounds — the way we combine these holistically as a whole and as its constituent parts is what matters and how that affects us. Any mystical ratios derived from these numbers are equally arbitrary. I think its positive to experiment with different pitch centres, is just a rudimentary agreement between a bunch of Europeans, lol.

I understand that arterficial tuning alters the MP3 or CD or what have you and is probably not the best way to go about it. Most likely recording onto CD in Hz would be the best alternative of course. I had thought of this as well myself when experimenting with such software. Mostly i noticed just a lower volume less ear piercing.

I also know that beyond altering, we humans also alter with amplifiers and equalizers and digital processors and stereo sound and whatever. This in itself would alter anyway. MP3 or any compressed music willalways lose the real effect and the vibration people are talking of is not heard by the ear but felt. This is my assumption with this experiment — Altering the sounds from the music from Hz to Hz is still altering to that vibration, whether it sounds poor or loses quality in musicianal skill etc.

In other words, people maybe confused because the sound feels good but sounds crap. At Hz sounds clear but gives not so great emotions. I believe the experiment was to try and give people an idea that altering via arterficial means is not really going to produce a clearer sound.

However the vibration range of that sound is inconclusive, probably why there is almost an equal outcome with each. I have listened to songs in the range that i liked, DJ processed. That is another point also.

Liking the song to begin with also helps with outcome. Finally the reason people are converting music is for the vibration, not the music. If the music was converted before recording would probably be the ultimate. One post above lead to another site with example of Pink Floyd. One clue he said is that he liked it both ways because the song was brilliant to begin with. Recording also has an effect such as poor quality to high quality, whether people like a song.

Music bring lots of different emotions and one person many years ago said maybe music is the universal language because i said it is hard to differentiate between accents, when they sing. Anyway, for both sides it is good to examine things from different perspectives so we can get to the bottom of things. However it is probably better to do what you believe personally because there is just too much arguing in this world and the internet may have brought us closer but it has also made us argue more and have blogs with posts 10 mile long over such simple things.

It was the only thing to help at the time. I did not listen to Television or anything. I just went to work, came home put on the headphones. Hollin Jones on Nov 22, in News 0 comments.

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